The VP Debate: Too Bad Dick Cheney's Best Line Was A Lie

Published on October 6, 2004 By blogic In Politics

Cheney's best line of the night was that he had never met Edwards before the debate. Unfortunately for Cheney, it was easy for the Blogosphere to prove this assertion wasn't true. Already, the most popular interesting debate story at yahoo -- that is, story that isn't a generic roundup -- is about the falsehood of Cheney's quip.

On this point, that helps Edwards. I doubt that voters care whether Edwards was present at the Senate while campaigning -- this is not a frame that has any traction. Cheney was smarter when he went more generally after Edwards's lack of experience and he should have hammered that more. Cheney's false statement about meeting Edwards directly plays into a worry that people already have about Cheney -- that he may be dishonest -- and connections to a general concern by voters that Bush and Cheney seem cocooned from the reality in Iraq.

A final note on which attacks work against which candidates. You'll notice that Edwards kept saying that Cheney was dishonest. This is an attack that would not have worked against Bush. People trust Bush, which is why Kerry generally says Bush is mistaken about Iraq, not dishonest. People are worried that Bush is distanced from reality, but they aren't worried about Bush's truthfullness. Similarly, Bush could have made the I've-Never-Met-You mistake that Cheney did, and no one would have cared. But people are already worried about Cheney's honesty, so he bleeds.

Comments (Page 4)

blogic

on Oct 06, 2004

"I think Cheney was mistaken. I don't think he intentionally lied."

Do you see that Cheney's statement about his own attendance as Senate President was very misleading?

The Trellinator

on Oct 06, 2004

What? So now you want to pin Cheney's lie on Edward's memory? It doesn't matter if Edward remembered meeting Cheney or was too much of a fool not to mention it.

If you buy the explanation that Cheney was innocently "mistaken" then I have a bridge I'd like to sell you in Arizona...

Cheney's remark was clearly prepared. As the subject of this post indicates, it was his best line of the night. So, you think that the VP can remember all those numbers "facts" and figures about Edwards's voting record and then not remember whether or not he ever met him? You think that Cheney and his keepers spent all that time before the debate compiling and considering how to best twist figures like this "You've missed 33 out of 36 meetings in the Judiciary Committee, almost 70 percent of the meetings of the Intelligence Committee." and then just didn't check to see whether Cheney ever really met Edwards? Yeah, right.

The last remark in Cheney's answer about not meeting Edwards was clearly set up as the punch line of his statement. In a casual conversation or spontaneous arguement, that explanation might fly, but not in the Vice Presidential debate.

I think Edwards is the one who either forgot meeting Cheney, or was so stunned by the VP's lying that he frankly didn't know how to respond. Eitehr way, it doesn't matter, the point is that you can't blame Edwards's memory for Cheney's lie. It doesn't work like that.

RedneckHunter

on Oct 06, 2004

Edwards is just that. His senate record indicates that he merely got elected as a stepping stone to the Presidency.

Funny, what "experience" did Junior have when he ran for President. Hell what experience did Schwarzeneggar have to run for "Guvnor"...? MONEY

The Trellinator

on Oct 06, 2004

It doesn't matter where they met or how they met and Edwards's attendance in the senate is really another matter altogether. It doesn't matter whether Edwards was there 100% of the time or 0% of the time. It doesn't matter whether they met on the senate floor or at a peep show. The point is that Dick Cheney lied, and nothing about Edwards--neither his attendance nor his memory--changes that, not one iota.

bakerstreet

on Oct 06, 2004

"It doesn't matter whether Edwards was there 100% of the time or 0% of the time. It doesn't matter whether they met on the senate floor or at a peep show. The point is that Dick Cheney lied,"

Ah, the droning mantra of Bush-haters... Lies, Lies, Lies... and yet, nothing ever seems to come of it...

The Trellinator

on Oct 06, 2004

I wonder what the families of our dead troops would think about that statement?

Oh, I think that lots has "come of" their lies and hopefully in November we'll be able to add a new administration to the list.

Ah, the droning mantra of Bush-haters... Lies, Lies, Lies... and yet, nothing ever seems to come of it...

The fact of the matter is, that you know it's true, and this is all you can say.

Ah, the blatent disregard of honesty from the Bush-lovers...Lies, Lies, Lies, so what, who cares, what's the big deal?....

The Trellinator

on Oct 06, 2004

I wonder what the family members of our troops who've been killed in action would think about that statement.

Oh, I think that lots has come of their lies and hopefully come November we'll be able to add a brand new administration to the list.

Ah, the droning mantra of Bush-haters... Lies, Lies, Lies... and yet, nothing ever seems to come of it...

This is all you can say because you know you're wrong.

Ah, the blatent disregard of honesty of the Bush-Lovers...Lies, Lies, Lies and who cares, so what, it doesn't matter...

The Trellinator

on Oct 06, 2004

I wonder how the family of one of our soldiers killed in Iraq would feel about that statement.

Oh, I think plenty has come of their lies, and hopefully in November we'll be able to add a new administration to that list.

Ah, the droning mantra of Bush-haters... Lies, Lies, Lies... and yet, nothing ever seems to come of it...

This is all you can resort to because you know it's true, you know he lied and there is no reasonable defense.

Ah, the blatent disregard for honesty from the Bush-Lovers...Lies, Lies, Lies...and so what, who cares, what's the big deal...

COL Gene

on Oct 06, 2004

No matter who says anything about Bush that can be thought of as negative, some how it is Bush Bashing, or the source is not telling the truth, or they are old or they are Democrats , etc, etc, etc.

If God himself declared that George W. Bush lied or made a error, the Bush supporters would tell God he was wrong!!!!! Wake up Look at the lack of jobs, the deficit, the trade deficit, Gas prices, health care costs and our lack on an energy poicy that works, Iraq. All this is George W. Bush. Only the trade deficit existed in 2001 when he took office. He was the President that promised to establish a better atmosphere in this nation. He was to be the president of ALL the people. There has never been more discord in this country in my life time than in 2004 because of George W. Bush!

COL Gene

on Oct 06, 2004

If God himself came down and said George W. Bush lied or made a error, the Bush supporters would tell God he was wrong. Open your eyes- Look at lack of jobs, look at the deficit, trade, healthcare, gas prices, the way the Iraq War is going, No WMD etc etc etc.

Bungy32

on Oct 06, 2004

Ah, the droning mantra of Bush-haters... Lies, Lies, Lies... and yet, nothing ever seems to come of it...

Perhaps we'll be able to file this gem under "Famous Last Words." (Would that we were so lucky.)

I resent being called a Bush hater almost as much as I resent the double standard (some) Bush supporters deploy around these kinds of questions. I don't hate President Bush I just don't think he should be president. And increasingly I don't just think Kerry is a better alternative (ABBA etc.) -- I think he will make a very good president.

Yet again, I find myself listening to BakerStreet cling to and defend an OBVIOUS misstatement. What is so hard about saying, "Yeah, that wasn't quite accurate of the Vice President"? You still get to support the guy. You still get to go after Edwards for his manipulations of facts (and there were more than a few of those!) OMG...did you see that???? I just did with Edwards what I am asking you to do with Cheney. Problem is, repeatedly BakerStreet and his ilk are unwilling to admit even the slightest wiff of a fault with anyone associated with their candidate. Kinda like the President that way, huh? And maybe that's one of the clearest indications of the significant differences between these two candidates/parties/worldviews. One of them values consistency and stubbornly sticking to a course of action or line of argument even when the evidence does not support it. And frankly, that is WAY scarier than the so-called flip-flopping the Right is trying to attribute (in typical double standard fashion) to Kerry.

sandy2

on Oct 06, 2004

I implore all of you "CHENEY DIDN'T LIE" AND "YOU ARE BUSH HATERS" people to visit this most intresting site:

http://www.factcheck.org/article.aspx?docID=272

Cheney told you to go there, so if you won't take my word for it take his

messybuu

on Oct 06, 2004

I have a question. Was everything all the candidates (numbers, claims, etc.) said entirely factual? Who were the ones that made these lies? If I remember correctly, in the first debate, both Bush and Kerry said some things that weren't true. Was it true with Cheney and Edwards? If so, then I think we should all be recognizing that all of the candidates running for Presidents are huge liars who must be impeached.

Daiwa

on Oct 06, 2004

The sad truth is that both sides (all? sides) in a political campaign routinely make claims that opponents can call lies, because they are trying to cast "facts" in a light favorable to them. Getting into these "liar, liar, pants on fire" exchanges largely misses the point. Us poor voters have the job of sorting it all out and deciding on the basis of the preponderance of evidence (such as it exists) and our personal values and beliefs who is the better choice for President. May all who are eligible evaluate the candidates as best they can and exercise their right to vote.

Cheers,
Daiwa

rugbyshawn

on Oct 07, 2004

Newsweek reports that in the VP debate, Cheney gave all new reasons for why we went to war with Iraq. This article looks at why these new reasons hadn't been emphasized (mostly because they are misleading or untrue) and why the originial reasons are not being stressed by the Bush campaign (they've been disproved). Cheney saying he never said there were ties between Al Qaida and Iraq....that's just too easy to refute, but they prove it in this article.

"Cheney’s miscues on Iraq are especially notable because he has been perhaps the single most vigorous advocate—both internally and in public—for the war. " -Newsweek

The full article on the distortions by Cheney on Iraq last night. Link

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